Catalytic converter cleaner

[mikefamig]

Motech said

"If you do not get any Thermacter Air Injection codes, you can put this to bed as no problem."

Do you recall that the valve diaphragm does not hold vacuum? I do trust your opinion based on your years of experience and appreciate your sharing your knowledge so freely but I figured to replace it just based on the fact that the diaphragm leaks. That was assuming that I could get the part.

I have already tested both TAD and TAB solenoids by removing them, switching them with 12vdc and confirming that they actually do open and close using a vacuum gauge. Then I installed them and checked the vacuum hoses to their respective valves and both deliver vacuum to the valves without leaks. I have also run the self test and the truck has no codes.

Wouldn't you replace it for one that doesn't leak if it was your car?

 

[Motech]

Wouldn't you replace it for one that doesn't leak if it was your car?

No because A) I don't like to replace parts until necessary, and B) as I mentioned previously...

Valve may not hold vacuum, I don't recall.

I just do not know if vacuum retention is necessary for valve to still function. In all these Ford years, I can really only recall replacing them for physical damage, like busted from prying on them, frozen from long storage or burnt up from faulty check valve.

But Running On-Demand Self Test will definitely test the entire air injection system and set a code if it does not pump or dump on command.

Or a quick check if you don't have On Demand capacity, activate the TAB solenoid on and off at idle (or just run a manifold vacuum source to valve) and listen for dumped air out the muffler. Recall, it's in "BYPASS" mode with no vacuum applied.

 

[mikefamig]

OK now I learned about the vehicle Calibration and parts number list and I found that I've been searching the wrong part number.

This is what I have now based on the correct Calibration code from the label on the truck

 

[Motech]

OK now I learned about the vehicle Calibration and parts number list and I found that I;ve been searching the wrong part number.

This is what I have now based on the correct Calibration code from the label on the truck

I posted up the Motorcraft and Standard part numbers because of all the superseding Ford number changes and parts obsolescence.

 

[goodO1boydws]

Most of the engineering and superseded part numbers up there eventually cross to a diverter valve.

MOTORCRAFT CX222A is the bypass valve.

View attachment 30491

It bolts directly to pump, so if your hose ****** (EDIT: Really? F L A N G E is a dirty word? Where did you mods grow up?) cannot be swapped over from old valve, then you'd need to mount to pump and get creative with your hoses.

Also crosses to Standard DV3 here on ebay a little cheaper than Motorcraft.

View attachment 30492

I'm going to reiterate - have I steered you wrong yet?

Before buying one, test your system.

• First make sure all vacuum hoses from manifold to solenoids to valves are impeccable
• Then run Ford's On-Demand, Engine Running Self-Test.

If you do not get any Thermacter Air Injection codes, you can put this to bed as no problem.

Motech, Good job!

Something you wrote resonated with me.

On this site they definitely need some new word search algorithms.
Or maybe someone who edits for AMERICAN English IN CONTEXT.

In American English, there are any number of ordinary words that can be used in a suggestive manner, but F L A N G E? That WAS a new one for me too.

Evidently its a BRITISH English import, one that started out as a joke on "the telley". (Like some older English vehicle's electrical systems.)

Looking in the Urban Dictionary-there are now a LOT of phrases made of (temporarily) "tame" words used in combination with the aforementioned one, producing equally questionable, related definitions.

Personally, I'll be surprised if the editing here doesn't soon stop allowing enough commonly used words and phrases being used in an "automotive connection" that it makes communication significantly more difficult if not impossible in some situations.
"Automotive" covers a lot of territory, including electrical, hydraulics, pneumatics, and mechanical matters and working on vehicles, and in their use also requires a familiarity with many different types of tools.

In the example below I'm using simple, everyday, words in a perfectly straightforward manner, to describe an occasionally necessary task.

I suppose that in the minds of some people having the proclivity to find filth everywhere they look, even this could be found objectionable.

When threading a drilled hole.

1. Make certain that the recess or tap is well-lubricated, to allow entry of tap to produce the desired result without unnecessary effort.
2. Begin to slowly introduce the threaded tap into the already prepared close tolerance recess.

(It should be noted here that, depending on the diameter of the tap, and the depth of the recess to be prepared, to achieve the ideal outcome care must be exercised in the speed of advancing the tap.)

3. After entering the recess, and while the tap is producing the desired results, after a short advance it will be necessary to withdraw the tap a short distance before proceeding deeper. This is to help ensure that further progress is made with minimal chance of damage to either tap or recess.
3. Continuing the process, frequently using partial entry and partial withdrawal, should help in producing the best results.
Taking care to not over-advance the tap will help further insure the best outcome.

 

[mikefamig]

No because A) I don't like to replace parts until necessary, and B) as I mentioned previously...



I just do not know if vacuum retention is necessary for valve to still function. In all these Ford years, I can really only recall replacing them for physical damage, like busted from prying on them, frozen from long storage or burnt up from faulty check valve.

But Running On-Demand Self Test will definitely test the entire air injection system and set a code if it does not pump or dump on command.

Or a quick check if you don't have On Demand capacity, activate the TAB solenoid on and off at idle (or just run a manifold vacuum source to valve) and listen for dumped air out the muffler. Recall, it's in "BYPASS" mode with no vacuum applied.

View attachment 30493

Now you're talkin! It would never occur to me to switch the solenoid and listen to the muffler, that kind of thinking comes from experience.

Wish I though of it. I'll feel much better to have some sense that the thing is working.

 

[mikefamig]

I spoke to a Ford dealer and when I gave him my calibration code he said "UH OH" which is not what you want to hear from the parts guy.

He tells me I have a California emission system. That may explain why it has two catalytic converters, cat and pre-cat. It feels a little under-powered to me but maybe that has something to do with it. That and the fact that I am used to driving a 385 HP F-150.

 

[mikefamig]

No because A) I don't like to replace parts until necessary, and B) as I mentioned previously...



I just do not know if vacuum retention is necessary for valve to still function. In all these Ford years, I can really only recall replacing them for physical damage, like busted from prying on them, frozen from long storage or burnt up from faulty check valve.

But Running On-Demand Self Test will definitely test the entire air injection system and set a code if it does not pump or dump on command.

Or a quick check if you don't have On Demand capacity, activate the TAB solenoid on and off at idle (or just run a manifold vacuum source to valve) and listen for dumped air out the muffler. Recall, it's in "BYPASS" mode with no vacuum applied.

View attachment 30493

Motech

To be clear, when you say "On-Demand Self Test" you are talking about shorting the test pin to negative battery, turning on the key and reading the flashing light codes, Yes? Nothing more?

 

[mikefamig]

I'm pretty sure that you guys are tired of talking about this bypass valve at this point and I know that I've been beating it into the ground but it's because I worry that the catalytic converters will be damaged if the system isn't working properly.

Well I had a breakthrough in my thinking and understanding today.

Using

1 - what Motech said about manually switching the bypass valve and watching the exhaust port on the smog pump for air rushing out

and

2 The fact that the computer will tell the bypass valve to send the air to the exhaust when the engine is cold

I started the engine this morning when it was about 48 degrees and sure enough the thermactor exhaust port had a strong stream of air rushing from it on cold start. After warming for a few minutes the exhaust disappeared proving that the bypass valve had sent it to the diverter valve.

Now I'm ready to put this to rest comfortable that the TAB solenoid and bypass valve works. The diverter valve did hold vacuum and I'm going to assume that it is switching for now.

This was a good learning experience. I came into it with absolutely no knowledge of this thermactor system. I had never even heard the word thermactor until now and now I get it.

 

[Motech]

Motech

To be clear, when you say "On-Demand Self Test" you are talking about shorting the test pin to negative battery, turning on the key and reading the flashing light codes, Yes? Nothing more?

Honestly, I do not know. I have never accessed Ford EEV IV codes this way, have always used scan tools with factory Ford functions.

I suspect this method flashes "CONTINUOUS" codes. (Ford's title for memory codes) If so, it will not test air system.

Someone with deeper knowledge of this method may chime in and clarify.

 

[Motech]

When threading a drilled hole...

That there was some funny input @goodO1boydws

 

[L\Bronco]

Honestly, I do not know. I have never accessed Ford EEV IV codes this way, have always used scan tools with factory Ford functions.

I suspect this method flashes "CONTINUOUS" codes. (Ford's title for memory codes) If so, it will not test air system.

Someone with deeper knowledge of this method may chime in and clarify.

On the old EEC1V systems KOER (ENG running codes can be accessed with a jumper wire the same way the key on engine off codes are. Just with the engine running.
Warm up the engine to operating temp and with the engine running install the jumper, it should rev up to around 1500 RPM and run a series of tests, while that is going on it will flash the MIL 4 times quickly (1HZ) indicating it is an 8 cyl system, at this time you are supposed to turn the steering wheel rapidly half a turn back and forth (To activate the p\S press switch, step on the brake pedal and release, (once only) and cycle the O\d cancel switch if equipped. After about 30 to 40 seconds you should get one flash (10), This is a dynamic response request, Stomp the throttle to the floor and release quickly, (This tests the knock sensors) immediately after the goose test (as we called it) the fault codes will flash, if it passes you should get a 1-1 (11) no faults. Usually the list of flash codes during KOER was long. you can only do the KOER test once per key cycle as well.

Hope that helps Good luck

Cheers

 

[mikefamig]

On the old EEC1V systems KOER (ENG running codes can be accessed with a jumper wire the same way the key on engine off codes are. Just with the engine running.
Warm up the engine to operating temp and with the engine running install the jumper, it should rev up to around 1500 RPM and run a series of tests, while that is going on it will flash the MIL 4 times quickly (1HZ) indicating it is an 8 cyl system, at this time you are supposed to turn the steering wheel rapidly half a turn back and forth (To activate the p\S press switch, step on the brake pedal and release, (once only) and cycle the O\d cancel switch if equipped. After about 30 to 40 seconds you should get one flash (10), This is a dynamic response request, Stomp the throttle to the floor and release quickly, (This tests the knock sensors) immediately after the goose test (as we called it) the fault codes will flash, if it passes you should get a 1-1 (11) no faults. Usually the list of flash codes during KOER was long. you can only do the KOER test once per key cycle as well.

Hope that helps Good luck

Cheers

WOW!

 

[WesT]

I am refurbing a 1989 Bronco 351W with all stock equipment. When I first started to drive it it seemed to have a restricted exhaust based on the sound of wind rushing from the exhaust tailpipe when I revved it and a lack of power on hills. I have been working on the fuel supply and injection system and have been running some sea foam earlier and now some Chevron techron fuel system cleaner and the noise has become less. I have revved the engine to 4500 rpm on the road it seems much better now than when it first left the barn. Power has also increased but I have been making other improvements along the way.

So I would like to hear members experiences with sea foam and techron and their ability to clean a catalytic converter. I would also like any recommendation for a good cat cleaner. Any and all opinions welcome.

Mike.

No idea on cat converter issue, but I made some changes to mine ( 1990 ) that helped a lot. Mine was missing the cold air intake ( which prob did nothing as it was blocked by the hood anyway )but I got a ford 461 cold air intake for 50$, it fits perfect in the hole next to radiator behind front grill and snapped into air intake perfectly as well, only had to trim the curved edge on it up front. I also added dual exaust that vents out right behind rear tires. Better acceleration and I’m sure better mileage ( but it’s not huge lol ).

 

[mikefamig]

No idea on cat converter issue, but I made some changes to mine ( 1990 ) that helped a lot. Mine was missing the cold air intake ( which prob did nothing as it was blocked by the hood anyway )but I got a ford 461 cold air intake for 50$, it fits perfect in the hole next to radiator behind front grill and snapped into air intake perfectly as well, only had to trim the curved edge on it up front. I also added dual exaust that vents out right behind rear tires. Better acceleration and I’m sure better mileage ( but it’s not huge lol ).

Not like I wouldn't like to get a little better gas mileage from this beast but I'm committed to keeping it bone stock. If I was to change the air box I think I'd go with K&N but that cost $400 and it would take a long time to get that back in increased gas mileage. I won't be driving the Bronco much, I plan to keep it and take it to a show now and then.

 

[ablediver]

Motech,

I've located several cans of the BG 44K FSVJ (Fuel System Voodoo Juice). I've got a 90' XLT w/ 5.0 and 96' EB w/5.8L. They have the standard 32 gal. tanks. What's the BG 44K / gallon gas mix ratio ? I don't know if it matters, but these are non-CA-emissions vehicles. Appreciate the reply.

Ablediver out

 

[Motech]

. What's the BG 44K / gallon gas mix ratio ? I

I don't remember off top of my head, but all those measurable results I cited were after adding 1can of 44K into 8-16 gallons max.

If you're mixing it with a full tank, I'd go two cans.

 

[ablediver]

Motech,

Copy that. Appreciate the reply. I want to order the necessary amount for both of them. I don't know if I'll find this again this easy. I'll get a few cans for spares as well. Thanks much.

Ablediver out.

 

[L\Bronco]

I don't remember off top of my head, but all those measurable results I cited were after adding 1can of 44K into 8-16 gallons max.

If you're mixing it with a full tank, I'd go two cans.

That is right on the money.
44k is amazing stuff.
I can't count the times It saved injector replacements when I was still on the bench.
Do they still have the tokens in the cans?
I haven't used it in years!

 

[Motech]

Do they still have the tokens in the cans?

They did the last one I cracked a couple years back!
Was a shop though, so...?