Catalytic converter cleaner

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mikefamig

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I am refurbing a 1989 Bronco 351W with all stock equipment. When I first started to drive it it seemed to have a restricted exhaust based on the sound of wind rushing from the exhaust tailpipe when I revved it and a lack of power on hills. I have been working on the fuel supply and injection system and have been running some sea foam earlier and now some Chevron techron fuel system cleaner and the noise has become less. I have revved the engine to 4500 rpm on the road it seems much better now than when it first left the barn. Power has also increased but I have been making other improvements along the way.

So I would like to hear members experiences with sea foam and techron and their ability to clean a catalytic converter. I would also like any recommendation for a good cat cleaner. Any and all opinions welcome.

Mike.
 

chrlsful

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I'm not one to hype Sf. I think it's too strong. I hear guys talk about it getting into the wrong fuel and ignit system parts. CC cleaners will not do magic to your cc. Only a replacement will.
 

Motech

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Hey there @mikefamig

My long automotive service career includes 32 years a licensed State of California Smog Check Inspector and Technician, so I have extensive emissions experience, including providing official state-sponsored training to existing licensed technicians on catalytic converter performance. Needless to say, I've dealt with a lot of catalyst issues over the years.

Frankly, I've seen very limited success with liquid voodoo cat refreshers. Many guarantees, but the fine print always puts the onus on you to prove your engine is in a good level of tune and running good, +/- 2% stoichiometric fuel control (14.7:1 air/fuel ratio). Such precise fuel control is necessary for a catalyst to convert bad gasses to inert, and there is not much that any juice can do to improve that cat's efficiency if fuel control is not spot-on.

However, if the additive is effective in helping clean the injectors and maybe even remove carbon deposits that were hindering intake air/fuel flow, and this brought fuel control back into the happy zone, the secondary effect of that might be that the catalyst is now able to do it's job better and reduce tailpipe emissions more effectively. So there's that, but it's not the juice bringing the cat around; it's the better running.

Far as "cleaning" the cat goes, you might have a real good running engine in ideal fuel control, but it's also burning a lot of oil, say worn valve guide seals (think 70s-80s Chevy 305, or every ford V8 same era that isn't called 302 or 5.0) That wet oil in the exhaust can and will contaminate the cat. First it will reduce cat temps and render the conversion process useless as they need to be hot to function. But they will still get hot enough to scorch that oil to an internal, baked on coating. The only way to "clean" that up is extreme heat. Frankly, the additives won't do that.

What will though is a misfire. I've dealt with many such scenarios where an oil-baked cat caused high emissions and inspection failures. First off, I don't want to fail my customers, and secondly, I don't want all that oil content drawn into my analyzer. Often times I will "precondition" the cat by running the engine at 2500 RPM for an extended period, say ten minutes to see if it will get hot enough on it's own to burn off the oil. If still a little skanky, I'll spray about a 5 second, regulated blast of carburetor cleaner into a vacuum hose at 2500 RPM 6-8 times over a 3-4 minute period. This creates controlled misfiring that dumps raw fuel into the cats, which ignites upon entry, super-heating that cat and cooking that oil film right out of there. Another 3 minutes at 2500 RPM to regain fuel control and settle that cat back down and you have VERY clean tailpipe emissions levels within that sweet smell of conversion.

I'd venture to say your driveability improvements are the biggest contributor to your performance gains, and even your tailpipe hiss. But not through opening up restricted cats. Nothing will do that except a big pry bar and hammer to gut it out. But with these older EFI Ford mills, air injection can cause that bummer noise. And a poor running engine can cause the EEC IV feedback controls to keep that air injection pumping into the exhaust way more than it should be. As you've improved your fuel control, your PCM is picking up on it and diverting more air to atmosphere than exhaust. Hence it's quieter.

The juice may have helped in your improvements, but again, only within the fuel control arena, and definitely NOT in any physical cat therapy.

Within that fuel control arena, additives can and often are beneficial. Not as much anymore with the increasingly more precise fuel metering technology and gasoline detergent formulas, but they still help more than hurt. On older rigs that are more susceptible to injector slop--like the mechanical Bosch systems of German yore, and even our Ford EEC IV EFI systems--can benefit tremendously from liquid voodoo. I have poured a bottle into a half-tank on an old Benz or Beemer running too rich to pass emissions, take it for a rip up the mountain and back (about 25 miles of hard serpentine driving) and return with compliant emissions levels and a noticeably smoother running engine. Wow!

But of all the products I've tested (and I've run a lot of before/after a tankful fuel control analysis in my time), I'm sorry to say very little changes have been achieved with consumer blends. When there were improvements, it has always been with OBD I systems, never anything modern. And the only two that registered any improvements on the older systems are the two you have already chosen. So chances are they've had a good effect for you.

The absolute very best additive I've used is a brand long available only to commercial shops, and that's BG brand 44K blend, part no 208.

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It's been on the consumer market now for some years, but no guarantees it's the same formula, especially if the pn is not 208, and definitely not the product in the plastic Techron style bottles.

If you find it, and it's the steel pop-top can with PN 208, buy it. Expect to pay $30.00 a can, but worth it.

Get the funnel kit too. Thjis stuff etches flesh, and not easy to accurately pour out of that can. The BG funnel is sized to the can and snaps on tightly.


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mikefamig

mikefamig

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Motech

Thanks for the lengthly reply and WOW I'm going to have to read it at least twice to absorb it all but to sum it up I think that you are saying that the additives will help the fuel delivery and injectors but no help for the catalytic converter.

I did add the sea foam and techron stuff to help with the injectors and maybe any check valves like in the tank pump that may be stuck but was hoping that it could also be helping the two cats. I saw a video on youtube where the guy sprayed a can of sea foam into the O2 sensor hole just upstream of the cat and let it sit for a while before burning it out. It seemed to me like he was making for an explosive situation.

It would be very difficult to break the inner converter parts out of the thing because it has two converters in what looks like a welded unit. The rear pre-cat could be poked out and cleaned but the front one I fear would be impossible. If I was able to poke out the converters wouldn't that cause a code in the computer? I would think that at least the O2 ssensor would notice. Do you have any first hand experience doing this?

Mike.
 

jdabnabe

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I just recently got my 94 Bronco back on the road too and have some of the same issues. I ran two bottles of the Techron cleaner through it and noticed an improvement as well. Then I was taking off from a stop light one day and the truck wouldn’t go. I barley made it up the hill and once I got it to 55 in overdrive it seemed fine. Luckily I was heading to Advance anyway and pulled in the parking lot. I noticed that the exhaust was pinging and popping like me diesel after a Regen. I thought I had clogged cats because the other symptom was really hard shift like an B&M shift kit used to do. I pulled a vacuum test on it and it seemed fine. I drove it for he next few days and every time it got hot it would do the same thing.

SO, I did what anyone would do that was convinced it was the cat and took out my Sawzall and cut the out Only to find that they looked brand new. I will take some pictures and post them here. I am convinced that the Techron and whatever caused the malfunction is the reason.

I will also add that all of my emissions systems are intact. My guess now is that it’s the EGR…

Anyway, I will post those pics for you.
 

Motech

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If I was able to poke out the converters wouldn't that cause a code in the computer? I would think that at least the O2 ssensor would notice.
No and no.

Catalytic converters were not monitored until OBD II showed up in 1996, and were exempted in trucks until 1998 (though some truck manufacturers complying in 1996, especially Ford as their EEC IV Self-Test capabilities were the inspirational impetus for OBD II) The upstream sensors are for fuel control feedback only, and have no idea how much oxygen is present in the downstream exhaust samples.

With that, all OBD I systems--and I do mean all, as in global--did not incorporate the oxygen sensors downstream of the catalyst that are necessary for catalyst efficiency monitoring. And why would they? Catalyst codes were (and still are) the toughest consequential Check Engine light issues for us all--consumers and service professionals alike--to stomach since the advent of OBD II. Heck, this provision is directly responsible for producing a catalyst black market causing epidemic cat theft crime waves everywhere.

Do you have any first hand experience doing this?
Doing what, oxygen sensor and cat code experience? Ya.

Gutting catalytic converters? Ya too, in my stupider youth for performance gains, especially GM's old flat, pellet-style, dual-bed units (which were quite easy to gut, as are damaged three-way units too) I have not "gutted" one since before my official state inspector certification, and would still be stupider in my official status to publicly acknowledge federal emissions tampering violations if I had.

I could envision cutting a plugged cat out of, say, a contractor's work truck and welding in a TEMPORARY straight pipe bypass so he could go forth and generate the revenue needed to replace these pricey units, but that's just a ponder y'know.

And since we're touching on it, gutting a cat in theory should reduce back-pressure and improve performance so long as the intake airflow can match the added capacity. And all O2 feedback systems have the capability to adapt to such relatively tame flow increases quite effectively without any tuning or chip mods. Why then do some feel a negative impact? Because a gutted cat leaves a great big chamber for exhaust gasses to expand and tumble around in on their way out the chute,banging and bouncing themselves off the back wall before their luckier, straight shooting brethren grab them by the ankles and drag them out with them. This can (and does) totally negate, often even reducing any theoretical flow improvement gains. It's exactly the opposite of the beneficial scavenging effects of a pair of awesome, tuned, full-length collector headers, and all you'll mostly get is a raspy exhaust note that's the aural opposite of the sweet tinking song those headers evoke. Along with a little extra turbulence-induced pressure under loads.

In my view, the only time you'll feel performance gains is when you gut a plugged cat that is choking off the engine. Even that is just restoring, not enhancing power output.

Straight pipe is a (slightly) different story though.
 

Motech

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I am convinced that the Techron and whatever caused the malfunction is the reason.

I doubt it. Techron is pretty tame, and your fuel system is pretty robust. About the only way injector juice might cause driveability issues would be if it knocked loose up some scaling flakes inside the fuel rail that flowed down and clogged your injector ports, but this is a Ford, not a Jeep.

The other extreme possibility is it's doing it's job and breaking up some real heady carbon deposits on your valves, and chunks are jamming up in the valve face and preventing good sealing. This does happen sometimes with intense fuel system cleaning with a pressurized machine, or Top Engine Cleaner back in the carburetted days.

But these two things are very rare, would not cause shifting issues and would not likely be consistent with heat.

the other symptom was really hard shift like an B&M shift kit used to do.

Ford had a string of pattern failures that would exhibit similar symptoms due to corrupted input from the Manual Lever Position (MLP) sensor, with a TSB describing contaminated harness connectors and sensor due to moisture intrusion. (I'll paste the TSB text below) You could be suffering this issue, though I'm not convinced heat would cause such consistent shenanigans.

My guess now is that it’s the EGR…

Don't go there just yet. Unlike GM, Toyota and Mitsubishi that often suffer misfiring and power loss from too much EGR flow, EGR rarely causes driveability issues with EEC IV. When they do cause issues, it's usually improved throttle response and power levels from no flow, and maybe too some pinging under load. This will turn on the Check Engine light during extended freeway drones too.

If you want to ease your mind though, simply unplug the vacuum hose from the EGR valve--no need to plug it--drive it and see if it affects your symptoms.

I drove it for he next few days and every time it got hot it would do the same thing.

The absolute numero uno issue with EEC IV that causes heat-induced fuckery is a failing PIP (Profile Ignition Pickup) sensor, or Cyl ID, Crankshaft position, camshaft position, and whatever other sensor some may call it. It's the digital sensor inside the distributor, and when it starts to flake out, it will cause primary trigger tomfoolery for the ignition coil and fuel injectors. Two hints to nail this guy:
  1. Tachometer may visibly flicker during worst symptoms
  2. Disconnecting SPOUT (SPark OUTput, AKA your ignition timing connector) during symptom will improve said symptoms
It will set codes too, though not always. It usually won't turn on the MIL, but almost always will code up with either a PIP or IDM code (Ignition Diagnostic Monitor) in a KOER On-Demand Self-Test) WHEN ACTING UP.

That's where my first focus would be. If it runs better with SPOUT disconnected, just replace your distributor with a quality brand, or better yet, hand yours to an old-school Ford guy to press apart and install a quality PIP sensor into. It will be pricier than a replacement distributor, but far better quality. and if it doesn't cure you Bronco's hiccups, I'll reimburse you for it. (not for a replacement distributor though)

Still uncertain if that will help your shifting problems, but I do not buy into coincidence, so fingers crossed.

Another thing that could cause both issues is a bad TPS (Throttle Position Sensor), especially if you've cleaned your throttle bodies with direct spray. The harsh cleaners will leach right down into the throttle shaft bores of the bottom throttle body, into the waiting arms of the TPS standing ready to catch, funnel and store it inside the mechanical potentiometer chamber. It will fail gradually, often random like yours, and it's conceivably sensitive to start off heat-induced. (though not as 100% heat symptomatic as PIP failure) This will mess with your throttle response and your injector timing, often messing up your idle pretty badly with popping, misfiring, rich mixture and stanky tailpipe. And... It most definitely will put a smack-down on your shifting algorithms too. No real simple trick to cheater-test it, but disconnecting it may result in default MAF or MAP substitution values and restore favorable performance once it sets a code from the open circuits unplugging it created. You may have to coax that code with a couple of key cycles and throttle sweeps though, so be patient. Note I said MAY result in default, not will, because sometimes it will not, and I don't remember when Ford developed that programming element. So with that is my disclaimer: If you achieve that default improvement, you can be reasonably confident TPS is shot. But if it makes no difference, or even runs worse, that will not rule it out, and it might still be bad.

Once again my logorrhea has blown up an entire post, so I'm going to paste that MLP TSB below in the next box.
 

Motech

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A/T - E4OD SHIFT CONCERNS/DTC'S SET

Article No.
95-2-12
01/30/95

^ TRANSMISSION - E40D - DIAGNOSTIC TROUBLE CODES - WATER INTRUSION OF THE MLP/TR SENSOR
^ TRANSMISSION - E40D - POSSIBLE WATER INTRUSION INTO THE MLP/TR SENSOR CAUSING SHIFT CONCERNS AND/OR HARSH ENGAGEMENT CONCERNS
^ TRANSMISSlON - E40D - SHIFT CONCERNS AND/OR HARSH ENGAGEMENT CONCERNS DUE TO WATER INTRUSION OF THE MLP/TR SENSOR

LIGHT TRUCK:
1989-94 BRONCO
, ECONOLINE, F-150-350 SERIES, F-47, F-53, F-59

ISSUE:
Some vehicles may exhibit a shift concern and/or a harsh engagement concern due to water intrusion into the MLP/TR sensor and vehicle harness. There may also be a number of different DTC's along with those concerns.

ACTION:

Replace the MLP/TR sensor and vehicle harness connector if signs of water penetration are evident. Refer to the following for service details.

SERVICE PROCEDURE

1. Verify the customer concern.
2. Perform normal on-board diagnostics.
3. Inspect the MLP/TR sensor for signs of water contamination.
4. If water penetration is present and/or DTC's have been set, replace the MLP/TR sensor and the vehicle harness connector with the TR Sensor Service Kit (F5TZ-7A247-A).

The TR Service Kit contains:

^ One (1) TR Sensor
^ One (1) Connector Assembly
^ One (1) "Red" Pin Separator Plate
^ One (1) 6-Pin Grommet
^ One (1) 8-Pin Grommet
^ One (1) 7-Pin Grommet
^ One (1) Instruction Sheet

PART NUMBER / PART NAME

F5TZ-7A247-A / TR Sensor Service Kit


OTHER APPLICABLE ARTICLES: NONE

OPERATION / DESCRIPTION / TIME

950212A Perform Electronic / Transmission Diagnostics, Replace MLP/TR Sensor / 2.0 Hrs.


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1663476872303.png
 

jdabnabe

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Here you go.
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I doubt it. Techron is pretty tame, and your fuel system is pretty robust. About the only way injector juice might cause driveability issues would be if it knocked loose up some scaling flakes inside the fuel rail that flowed down and clogged your injector ports, but this is a Ford, not a Jeep.
To clarify, I was referring to the Techron and the malfunction being the reason for the cats being so clean, not causing the malfunction.
 

jdabnabe

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Motech, you really are wealth of knowledge. I guess I have gotten spoiled with my OBDII cars. I did clean the throttle body out with a direct spray cleaner and I have not yet checked the TPS voltages yet. I did disconnect the EGR vacuum line and it seemed to run better. I pulled a vacuum on the EGR and it moved and it will throw a check engine light any time they are disconnected. I also disconnected the TAD/TAB vacuum lines and drove it but I’m not sure if the ambient air temp was hot enough either.

I have the new exhaust on that consists of a Magnaflow y-pipe and a Gibson cat back kit. My issue now is trying to get the thermactor air tube connected to the cat. It’s about a foot too short. Waiting on the Walker kit to come in for that.

It is throwing a CEL now though so I will pull codes today.
 
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mikefamig

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No and no.

Catalytic converters were not monitored until OBD II showed up in 1996, and were exempted in trucks until 1998 (though some truck manufacturers complying in 1996, especially Ford as their EEC IV Self-Test capabilities were the inspirational impetus for OBD II) The upstream sensors are for fuel control feedback only, and have no idea how much oxygen is present in the downstream exhaust samples.

With that, all OBD I systems--and I do mean all, as in global--did not incorporate the oxygen sensors downstream of the catalyst that are necessary for catalyst efficiency monitoring. And why would they? Catalyst codes were (and still are) the toughest consequential Check Engine light issues for us all--consumers and service professionals alike--to stomach since the advent of OBD II. Heck, this provision is directly responsible for producing a catalyst black market causing epidemic cat theft crime waves everywhere.


Doing what, oxygen sensor and cat code experience? Ya.

Gutting catalytic converters? Ya too, in my stupider youth for performance gains, especially GM's old flat, pellet-style, dual-bed units (which were quite easy to gut, as are damaged three-way units too) I have not "gutted" one since before my official state inspector certification, and would still be stupider in my official status to publicly acknowledge federal emissions tampering violations if I had.

I could envision cutting a plugged cat out of, say, a contractor's work truck and welding in a TEMPORARY straight pipe bypass so he could go forth and generate the revenue needed to replace these pricey units, but that's just a ponder y'know.

And since we're touching on it, gutting a cat in theory should reduce back-pressure and improve performance so long as the intake airflow can match the added capacity. And all O2 feedback systems have the capability to adapt to such relatively tame flow increases quite effectively without any tuning or chip mods. Why then do some feel a negative impact? Because a gutted cat leaves a great big chamber for exhaust gasses to expand and tumble around in on their way out the chute,banging and bouncing themselves off the back wall before their luckier, straight shooting brethren grab them by the ankles and drag them out with them. This can (and does) totally negate, often even reducing any theoretical flow improvement gains. It's exactly the opposite of the beneficial scavenging effects of a pair of awesome, tuned, full-length collector headers, and all you'll mostly get is a raspy exhaust note that's the aural opposite of the sweet tinking song those headers evoke. Along with a little extra turbulence-induced pressure under loads.

In my view, the only time you'll feel performance gains is when you gut a plugged cat that is choking off the engine. Even that is just restoring, not enhancing power output.

Straight pipe is a (slightly) different story though.

It is the complications with proper exhaust back-pressure and scavenging that make me think that gutting the converter might not serve my purpose. My purpose would be to restore performance to normal and not for any new gains. I'm thinking that my converter is restricted and hurting performance but don't know for sure. The truck only has 46000 miles on it but it was running badly with a dead MAP sensor when I got it and I don't know how long it ran badly and if that could effect the converter.

To complicate matters further, I tested the bypass valve and the diverter valve with a mighty-vac handheld vacuum tool. The diverter valve held vacuum but the bypass valve leaked down quickly when I applied vacuum to it. What is the point in replacing the converter if the air pump system is not working properly.

I might just replace the Y-pipe and converters if they were available which they are not. I have seen a magnaflow or flowmaster y-pipe which may be my only option short of a custom made exhaust. I need cat-back parts replaced but need to make a decision on the converters before replacing the pipes.

So it seems that the only way to know if gutting my converters is going to improve power would be to do it and see what I get. If they are clogged and I can poke them out then I retain the OEM pipes and keep the system original looking. This Bronco is a real survivor and I'd like to keep the OEM pipes if possible.
 
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mikefamig

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I have the new exhaust on that consists of a Magnaflow y-pipe and a Gibson cat back kit. My issue now is trying to get the thermactor air tube connected to the cat. It’s about a foot too short. Waiting on the Walker kit to come in for that.

How do you like that Magnaflow y-pipe? Did it fit well to the exhaust manifolds? Is the system quiet with the Gibson pipes?

Mike.
 

jdabnabe

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How do you like that Magnaflow y-pipe? Did it fit well to the exhaust manifolds? Is the system quiet with the Gibson pipes?

Mike.
It fit pretty well. I did have to cut about 3 inches off of the end of the converter pipe. Also, it didn’t come with any clamps but since I got it for a screaming deal I didn’t complain.

The Gibson exhaust is nice too but the clamps are terrible. I was trying to hang everything temporarily to make sure there was no rubbing and the tail pipe exited where I wanted it to. Well the clamp would not hold the tail pipe without me really cranking down on it. I went to remove it today and damaged the tailpipe so bad that I can’t use it. Hopefully I can buy another tailpipe without buying a whole new system. My only other complaint is hooking the thermactor fresh air pipe back up. Still waiting on that part…
 

jdabnabe

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Motech, you really are wealth of knowledge. I guess I have gotten spoiled with my OBDII cars. I did clean the throttle body out with a direct spray cleaner and I have not yet checked the TPS voltages yet. I did disconnect the EGR vacuum line and it seemed to run better. I pulled a vacuum on the EGR and it moved and it will throw a check engine light any time they are disconnected. I also disconnected the TAD/TAB vacuum lines and drove it but I’m not sure if the ambient air temp was hot enough either.

I have the new exhaust on that consists of a Magnaflow y-pipe and a Gibson cat back kit. My issue now is trying to get the thermactor air tube connected to the cat. It’s about a foot too short. Waiting on the Walker kit to come in for that.

It is throwing a CEL now though so I will pull codes today.
I seemed to have gotten my vacuum lined crossed so that probably explains the CEL.
 

goodO1boydws

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Hey Mike,

I didn't read through your entire original thread, but from the little you've written in this one, I'm still trying to figure out why you're focusing on the cats being a SIGNIFICANT problem. Seeing your level of concern, you HAVE pulled the 02 sensors to at least eyeball them and their connectors by now, right? Maybe they were just carboned up somewhat and that's burned off by now.

You wrote:

..."I have revved the engine to 4500 rpm on the road it seems much better now than when it first left the barn. Power has also increased but I have been making other improvements along the way...."

and :

..."
I'm thinking that my converter is restricted and hurting performance but don't know for sure. The truck only has 46000 miles on it but it was running badly with a dead MAP sensor when I got it and I don't know how long it ran badly and if that could effect the converter.

To complicate matters further, I tested the bypass valve and the diverter valve with a mighty-vac handheld vacuum tool. The diverter valve held vacuum but the bypass valve leaked down quickly when I applied vacuum to it. What is the point in replacing the converter if the air pump system is not working properly....



With only 46,000 original miles on them, unless they were fatally poisoned/clogged, the odds are in your favor that they aren't severely restricting the airflow. And your mentioning the power improvement and not choking the air flow at 4500rpm, but "...seeming much better..." seems to bear out that what you've been doing is what's responsible for the improvements, since you haven't altered the exhaust system.

Of course, with any engine and vehicle that have been sitting for a long time, there are MANY things that effect engine performance and vehicle performance that mimics an underperforming engine, especially liable to be most noticblle when initially restarting and driving it. And you've probably checked and corrected some of them, but possibly overlooked others.

Simple things such as bad gas, or a transmission that is either slipping or not shifting at the right times from seals/valves being sticky or diaphragms dried out with age.
Or NEWLY REPLACED brake pads/shoes (say a couple years ago, but having ZERO miles on them since) dragging-from sticking calipers or wheel cylinders. Or bearing in things such as the wheels, power steering pump, alternator or water pump dragging more than usual after being idle for so long. Or a couple "lazy" lifters, ones that were compressed for so long that they didn't want to pump up for a while; or a couple sticky intake or exhaust valves-or carboned up exhaust valves- any of them not seating well. Or rodents gnawing on wiring, or insects (like mud daubers, paper wasps, etc) partially clogging exhaust pipes; or simply having weakened grounds caused by oxidation or undisturbed corrosion that's more liable to happen over a long period of sitting idle.
 
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King Daddy Rabbit

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I am refurbing a 1989 Bronco 351W with all stock equipment. When I first started to drive it it seemed to have a restricted exhaust based on the sound of wind rushing from the exhaust tailpipe when I revved it and a lack of power on hills. I have been working on the fuel supply and injection system and have been running some sea foam earlier and now some Chevron techron fuel system cleaner and the noise has become less. I have revved the engine to 4500 rpm on the road it seems much better now than when it first left the barn. Power has also increased but I have been making other improvements along the way.

So I would like to hear members experiences with sea foam and techron and their ability to clean a catalytic converter. I would also like any recommendation for a good cat cleaner. Any and all opinions welcome.

Mike.
You didn’t mention where you live. In Texas after 25 yrs you can remove all emissions control devices legally. I bought my 1990 Eddie Bauer new. About 1998 one of the cast exhaust manifolds cracked. Crazy expensive. Wound up going to Summit or Jegs and getting Edelbrock replacement headers and flow through converter. Mileage and performance was amazing. Almost 3 mpg and much better acceleration. After that put Flowmaster cat back kit on. Even better. I just learned about emissions rules last yr while getting Genesis inspected. Now I’m in process of stroking original 302 to 331. Have gleefully ripped/cut out all the coffee cans, hoses, metal tubes going into heads and pumps. Installing AFR heads, custom ground cam, Edelbrock Pro Flo injection system. Should be around 400 hp and 375-400 ft torque when completed. This is my 3rd Bronco and I’ve loved them all. But it has been a dog since drove it off showroom floor 30+ yrs ago.
Check your states laws. Many consider these vehicles antiques and let a lot of stuff go.
 
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mikefamig

mikefamig

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You didn’t mention where you live. In Texas after 25 yrs you can remove all emissions control devices legally. I bought my 1990 Eddie Bauer new. About 1998 one of the cast exhaust manifolds cracked. Crazy expensive. Wound up going to Summit or Jegs and getting Edelbrock replacement headers and flow through converter. Mileage and performance was amazing. Almost 3 mpg and much better acceleration. After that put Flowmaster cat back kit on. Even better. I just learned about emissions rules last yr while getting Genesis inspected. Now I’m in process of stroking original 302 to 331. Have gleefully ripped/cut out all the coffee cans, hoses, metal tubes going into heads and pumps. Installing AFR heads, custom ground cam, Edelbrock Pro Flo injection system. Should be around 400 hp and 375-400 ft torque when completed. This is my 3rd Bronco and I’ve loved them all. But it has been a dog since drove it off showroom floor 30+ yrs ago.
Check your states laws. Many consider these vehicles antiques and let a lot of stuff go.
While it may be legal to remove the emission equipment I am trying to keep the car bone stock. It has only 47,000 miles with one owner and in a heated garage for all of it's years. The only alterations has been to add a hood lock, alarm system and trailer brake.Other than some dings and the underside being dirty it looks nearly new.

I may be forced to remove the emission equipment just for the fact that I can't get parts for it. The Air bypass valve does not hold vacuum and I suspect that the converter may be partially clogged and neither are available. And if I install a new converter with a bad bypass valve I'm worried that it'll harm the new converter.

At some point Imay just get disgusted and delete the system.

Mike.
 

goodO1boydws

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While it may be legal to remove the emission equipment I am trying to keep the car bone stock. It has only 47,000 miles with one owner and in a heated garage for all of it's years. The only alterations has been to add a hood lock, alarm system and trailer brake.Other than some dings and the underside being dirty it looks nearly new.

I may be forced to remove the emission equipment just for the fact that I can't get parts for it. The Air bypass valve does not hold vacuum and I suspect that the converter may be partially clogged and neither are available. And if I install a new converter with a bad bypass valve I'm worried that it'll harm the new converter.

At some point I may just get disgusted and delete the system.

Mike.

Mike,

Part of the old-car-owning-guys-and-gals mantra should be "EVERYTHING in the way of automotive parts IS available either already in existence or by fabrication" (I repeat this as many times as necessary).
The catch is, it does depend on how hard and long you're willing to look, and what you're willing to spend. When dealing with older vehicles having a slow-burning fuse and a good supply of patience definitely goes a long way.

Are you talking about the large volume EGR valve that is held on with 2 bolts?

(If so, there are lots of aftermarket ones available-and Ford probably didn't make theirs to begin with.) Did I hear someone say rockauto?
 
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mikefamig

mikefamig

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Mike,

Part of the old-car-owning-guys-and-gals mantra should be "EVERYTHING in the way of automotive parts IS available either already in existence or by fabrication" (I repeat this as many times as necessary).
The catch is, it does depend on how hard and long you're willing to look, and what you're willing to spend. When dealing with older vehicles having a slow-burning fuse and a good supply of patience definitely goes a long way.

As to that "air bypass vacuum valve", if its the one I'm thinking of (at the top of the engine?) have you tried cleaning the carbon out yet? They tend to gradually accumulate carbon with a little bit of oil, and it doesn't take much crud to keep the valve from seating completely.

Easiest way to tell if there's liable to be carbon in it is to flush out the vacuum line with a rubber-safe spray cleaner -like some used for brakes, and see what comes out on a white paper towel. If the cleaner is not rubber safe and is dissolving rubber it won't tell you anything meaningful-or help the valve.

Something else.
Depending on a vacuum valve's design sometimes there's a metal stem or plunger that has to go through a close tolerance metal hole and that stem/plunger can get a little surface rust and from then on it will drag if it isn't moved often enough. To overcome that drag, sometimes simply burnishing the part by repeated actuation is enough, other times a tiny bit of low viscosity lubrication helps.

I hear ya, and anything can be repaired. It's just a matter of how much time. energy and money you are willing to throw at it. I should have said that I have not been able to find thhe parts anywhere online. I know where I can get the pipes custom made in stainless but it sure would be nice if I could buy a direct fit replacement.

As for the bypass valve I am talking about the valve in the thermactor that the smog pump pumps air to. It may or may not be stuck I do not know but I do know that the vacuum diaphragm does not hold air. I have a hand-held vacuum pump and it leaks down quickly when a vacuum is applied. The part is installed on the truck so I can't test any further.

Mike.
 
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