few issues left with my 80 bronco

[kas13]

Hi everybody, I have a few things going on with by Ford that I was hoping someone hear could help me fix or lead me in the right direction. i got a 80 Bronco XLT with about 55k on a rebuilt engine and just recently got my transmission rebuilt which has gave me a new issue, I think.

1. After I got my truck from the transmission rebuilt I noticed I started to have a oil leak. I took it back to him and he assured me that where it was leaking from had nothing to do with what they work on and that it is not that bad so I shouldn't worry. I attached a pic of where the oil is leaking and and I also found a bolt sitting in the oil on that thing that I  am not sure where it goes. I bought a oil pressure guage that I plan on installing to keep a better eye on my level. So my question here is does anyone know what that is called where I took the pic and maybe where that bolt goes I found?

2. Sometimes it is hard to start. In the morning I have to let turn the key on for a minute floor the pedal, then pump as I turn to start it. If i cut it off for maybe less than 5 minutes it will start right back up first turn, but if I go longer than that I am back pumping on the pedal and it just turn for 5-10 seconds before it catches. Any reason why it does this? Battery, alt, starter, all tested good, I recently changed the sparks, icm, pcv valve and probably a few other things I'm forgetting right now.

3. Also this summer I noticed when I turned on my ac my truck started to make a chugging noise and almost cut off, I had to floor the pedal to keep it from cutting off.  Any clues what that could be?

Thanks

 

[Rons beast]

Hey Kas Welcome.

First please fill in your profile with all the info on your truck. (engine size , tranny, carb or FI, any modifications etc.) That will be a good starting point for any diagnosis.

Regarding the bolt you found, That has me baffled, as the pic shows the front differential; Specifically the underside. I don't understand how you found a bolt there because of ...well gravity!  Was it glued there?  taped?  do you have a pic of the bolt? More explanation is needed. It is unlikely that the trans work had anything to do with a diff leak. Or is there a leak over the diff and the oil is dripping onto it.  If so a you need to determine what on the engine is leaking.

BTW...an oil pressure gauge will indicate just that (pressure) not oil volume or level.  By the time the oil p. gauge reads too low there can already be damage to your engine.

As for your starting problem. If you have a carb it sounds like the choke need adjusting or the choke pull-off is misadjusted. OR the carb is allowing fuel to bleed out of the fuel bowl overnight and the carb needs a rebuild.

AC puts quite a strain on an engine.  Most older cars and trucks have a solenoid that raises the idle to compensate for the extra drag. Your AC idle compensator solenoid may need adjusting or isn't working or was accidently unplugged.

Good luck and let us know more about that strange bolt.  I hope it isn't the differential fill plug.

 

[kas13]

Hi Rons Beast,

Thanks for replying, I dont think I did the profile thing right but I did try..

I attached a few pics of the bolt I found. It was just sitting there in some oil and I had just got done driving it so how it stayed in place there I have no clue. It does appear to me as if the oil is dropping down onto that piece. Thanks for letting me know about the oil guage

I do have a carb on there and hopefully the choke pull off you stated is just misadjusted because I am pretty sure it has a fairly new carb.

I will probably just replace the solenoid if it is something I am able to do and see if that fixes the problem because I am sure it is old anyways.

*is this also called anything else, I cant find anything for it on Oreillys webiste?

Thanks alot for your help, I really appreciate it.

 

[Rons beast]

Hey Kas,

That is a pretty generic bolt. It's almost impossible to know where it came from.  It isn't the fill plug so you're safe there.

If you post a pic of your carb from a few different angles, especially the throttle cable side, I can probably tell if you have an idle compensator.

( it can be tricky sometimes know what slick name some engineers give some parts...IE, GM engineers call spark plugs " Secondary termination") 

A good way to find an oil leak is to clean the engine. Then dust the suspected area with baby powder. Run the engine and the leaking oil will show up in the baby powder at the point of the leak.

Good Luck

BTW: good profile info. Add the tranny and rear gear if known. Tires and any mods.

Thanks

 

[kas13]

I got a little picture happy out there so hopefully one of these works. Thank you for responding also. 

 

[Rons beast]

As they say...pics are worth a thousand words. From the pics you posted it looks like you got and oil  change or at least a new filter on July 29th. Makes me believe the oil on your front diff is oil that spills from the oil filter when it's removed. Wipe the old oil off as best you can and keep an eye on it. It most likely won't get any worse and probably will eventually dry up...until the next oil change. 

It doesn't look like you have an idle compensator. The aftermarket carb probably didn't come with one. You could call Eldelbrock and ask if they have on to work with your set up.

It also looks as if you have a manual choke. That means that you need to set the choke and pull it off properly according to the engine temperature. This is really old school stuff. You may want to look into an electric choke option.

I could get better views with the air cleaner removed and pics from the top.

Thanks for the pics you did post. they tell a lot.

Good Luck

 

[kas13]

Thanks again for responding, sorry I didnt even think to pull the air filter off there. I bought this as another guys project and I have already spent more than I paid for it so I am determined to fix her up, so another reason I am kind of dont know everything about it and this is the first vehicle I have owned with a carb and mastering that manual choke last winter was no joke. I got alot to learn still, but I love working on her. I will check on that idle compensator and also see if putting an electric choke on is something I can do or something I can work in the budget to get done. After seeing the pics would you still think the carb is allowing fuel to bleed out of the fuel bowl overnight?

I know when I got my oil changed, I noticed them spraying water under there so that has built up since then. I tried to look around and see where that bolt possibly could be missing from, but I didnt have any luck. I was thinking about cleaning the engine like you said, but I know when it was raining real hard out here my truck kept cutting off on me and I was suspecting that water was getting in the dis. cap because I didnt have a hood to cowl seal (still dont have the right one, pulled something off another truck at a junk yard to fill most of the space) so would it be safe to spray it down like that?

found this electric choke kit on amazon http://www.amazon.com/Edelbrock-1478-Electric-Choke-Kit/dp/B000CNAOKQ/ref=zg_bs_15727431_2/188-4767577-8994346

and this idle compensator http://www.amazon.com/Edelbrock-8059-Solenoid-and-Bracket/dp/B00062YCWY/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1439687139&sr=8-1&keywords=edelbrock+throttle+solenoid

also what exactly is a themostatic hot air choke, is that part I would add to the electric choke? 

 

[Rons beast]

Hey Kas,

From the info I have now, I think the starting issue is simply you learning the use of the manual choke for the situation and temperature the engine.

When the engine is stone cold, (like sitting overnight.) the choke has to be fully closed and the engine cranked. Immediately after the engine begins to fire the choke has to be opened slightly to allow some air to be drawn in.  Then it has to be opened more as the engine warms up.  When starting the engine when partly warmed up, the choke has to be closed only partly. How much is something that has to be learned by you. For this reasn it may be an advantage for you to add the automatic choke.

A thermostatic hot air choke, uses a small amount of air drawn from the manifold to heat the choke spring. The hotter the air the more the spring expands and opens the choke blade. The advantage is the choke uses a heat source directly from the engine and the choke spring is not getting warmed falsely by an electrical current.

The electric choke uses an electric current to gradually warm the spring and open the choke.  It isn't as accurately timed to the true engine temperature, but it is usually accurate enough to work very well while still being an easy install. ( the only problems may be if the key were left on in the run position for a time long enough to warm the choke when the engine is cold....not a usual occurrence.) 

Regarding the carb, there is no way for me to know if the fuel bowl is bleeding down. Since I now see that the carb is newer and not the original, I have less suspicion of that happening.

I also want to say the when you are starting the truck and pumping the gas, it is sending fuel into  the manifold richening the mixture. This will effect how much the choke should be open ( richer = greater opening) so you will have to figure how many, if any pumps of gas you want to feed an engine to help it start. (Generally after warm no extra is needed.)  

On the throttle solenoid...that is exactly what you need to compensate for the AC drag at idle. It should be wired into the circuit to power the AC clutch.

Hope this helped.

Good Luck

 

[kas13]

You definitely helped me out a whole lot and I really do appreciate it. I have a much better understanding of things now. I think an electric choke would be a good option for me and will order one soon, looks like a pretty easy to install also and will keep that solenoid on my to do list. Thanks again for your help, I'm not as knowledgeable as you but if I can ever return the favor on here and help someone else out I will be sure to do so.

 

[Rons beast]

You are welcome Kas,

The forum only has a value when members share and exchange info.  Keeping us informed on what worked to correct your problem, and what didn't, is one of the things you need to do here to help.

So keep us up to date.

Good Luck

 

[kas13]

Thanks again and I definitely will keep yall updated. I ordered that electric choke today, so after I get it and put it on there I will post on the difference it hopefully makes for my truck.

 

[kas13]

So I got it put on there this morning with a little help from the mechanic who did my transmission. I ran a few errands and it seems to be starting up a lot better, but it usually was starting okay if I didnt let it sit to long after turning it off so I guess I will know for sure in the morning when I go to start it if its on there correctly. He also mentioned the same thing you said about the fuel maybe bleeding out, but didnt say how I could check it out. If you notice in the pics its not on lined up correctly or something thats why there is that gap there (which was the problem I was having, that's why I took it to him) but he assured me that it is on there good I may just have to loosen it up and pull it forward a little in the morning if it does not start. I kind of feel like I am hearing it run rougher than it was before, maybe its all in me head.

 

[Seabronc]

There is nothing wrong with the mount.  The choke needs to be adjusted for your truck.  Take a look at this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gviih8tqKxc.

Good luck,

>-

This one will help you understand the choke better,even though it is talking about a Holey.  Pay attention to the comment right at the end.

 

[kas13]

thanks Seabronc for clearing that up for me and for the videos also, I checked out your pics on supermotors link, nice bronco you got. well luckily I didnt have to be anywhere this morning cause it was a pain to get to start. Kept cutting right off, I moved that thing foward and back and still didnt help, so after about 10-15 mins of trying I got her started and had to keep the pedal down to keep her running, there was a nice smoke show also. took it back to him it was sputtering real bad and almost sounded like it was going to cut off at the lights but i made it and he messed with it for awhile and put that spring over something because he said it didnt have enough weight and that I should be good now. I attached a pic with that spring on it and was wondering if someone might recommend doing something else.

 

[Rons beast]

Hey Kas,

I think you need to find another mechanic.  I never heard or had the need to weight the fast idle stop cam. Weighting the cam works against the force of the choke spring and thereby makes it impossible to adjust properly.   I bet you don't have the choke pulloff adjusted properly...or don't have a pulloff at all.

The choke spring is supposed to close the choke plate when the engine is cold, for the purpose of making the fuel mixture richer for easier starting. As soon as the engine is started, the engine vacuum should operate a vacuum device ( choke pull-off) to force the choke plate open slightly. At the same time the choke spring (through rods and levers) moves the fast idle cam to a position to make the engine ...well... Idle faster. As the choke warms up the spring moves the choke plate gradually open farther, and moves the fast idle cam to positions to lower the idle. If all the components are not adjusted properly cold starting and running can be poor.  All this has to be factored with the other parameters of the carb as well as the engine itself.  Engine vacuum from the cam, timing, carb jetting, can all add factors as how the choke should be adjusted.

At this point it would be very difficult to guide you through the proper adjustments with words. The fact that the mechanic you are taking it to may not have a great grasp of the workings of a carb just muddies the waters further.

Sorry if this sounds like a lot of negatives. 

My best advice now would be to find a shop that specializes in carb rebuilding and have them adjust yours.  Or...find a book or go online to get a carb manual. It would help you to learn the components and then understand better the workings of each.

Good Luck

 

[kas13]

Thanks Ronsbeast, 

I dont think I have the choke pull of you are talking about, Im really not sure at this point Im really frustrated and probably need to calm down a little. I couldnt get her to start at all this morning and I noticed a nice puddle of gas on my engine ( i included a pic) so I thought I would just hook back up that manual choke to it and I would be all good. No, the choke lever wont even pull out now and I have no clue what I have done wrong and what to do to fix it. I hate to depend on yall but hopefully someone can help me get her running again before tomorrow morning. I will definitely be spending the day doing my carb research. I attached a few pics hopefully it is obvious to someone what I did wrong this time.

 

[kas13]

Well I stepped away from it for awhile realized my choke cable was all bent up so I got that straightened, when to start rev's up really high so I cut it off and found my throttle cable was stuck. Tightened up a few hoses that some how got loose, so I think that took care of the gas problem. I'm sitting outside his shop right now waiting for him to get here, got a few choice words for him. Really wish I would have known to get a carb with the elec choke already built in ahead of time, cause what I spent on the part and paying him I would have been about half way there to getting in money wise.

* well i didnt get reimbursed for his crappy job, but I guess I feel a little better about telling him about himself. So that was $150 down the drain, hate feeling like I wasted money but what can i do know. Costly learning experience but at least I have more knowledge of carbs now.

 

[kas13]

Just want to update yall about the situation. Well I got my new Edelbrock #1406 carb yesterday, went to start her up to take her to the garage and nothing....Couldnt get a jump, called triple A, he had to hook up his battery box as well as his jumper cables to get her started. Turns out my fairly new starter was no good(was putting out at 349) and my battery was completely drained. So after getting everything put on, she started up perfectly. Then on the drive home when I would come to a stop a take off there was a little hesitation. Stopped at a store and when I got back it she acted like she didnt want to start again. Called my mechanic, he said put on a new solenoid if that dont fix it change my sparks. Went to Oreillys and did that, started fine and got home let her sit for a bit and went out to start and everything seems okay now. It does sound like its cranking to hard (or some abnormal noise) when I barely turn the key on. Thanks again for the help

* did some reading and realized I probably needed to adjust the accelerator pump on the carb, so I did that and hopefully that solved the hesitation problem. still not sure what was up with that one start

 

[Rons beast]

Hey Kas13,

A few things you posted raised an eyebrow:

1- (was putting out at 349)   Does that mean your battery has only 349 cranking amps?  That's too few for a 351 engine.  You need a bigger, ( more cranking amps) battery.

2- " called my mechanic he said put on a new solenoid. if that don't fix it change my sparks."   A solenoid works in the starting circuit. The spark plugs are the termination point in the secondary ignition circuit. One would not have anything to do with the other.  ( like saying, " if your shorts are too tight, change your socks." )

I would have second thoughts about that guy...unless he has some total Zen knowledge of automotive tech awareness that 99.9% of us don't possess.

Thanks for the update and Good Luck.