95 bronco will stall then wont start back...need help asap

[zdemon84]

my 95 5.8 bronco keeps stalling then wont start back up....it stalled on my way to work and wouldnt start back up.i would turn the key and hear the fuel pump but when i turned the key too start it, it would start but not turnover. i got it towed to pepboys (only place close) and their diagnostic said i needed a ignition module, distributor cap and rotor, and fuel filter. they did the module and it started up and i drove it home.i decided to do the cap, rotor and filter myself.it started up the next day and i replaced the cap and rotor but now i cant get it to start back up.it started once for about 15 seconds then just died.im completely lost on what the problem could be.this is my main source of transportation and im dying without it. HELP

 

[Seabronc]

Does it start after the engine cools off and then stalls after the engine warms up?

>-

 

[zdemon84]

no it wont start at all...everything starts just the engine wont turn over.

 

[Ccool]

Just my two cents.....once my 95 XLT started dying like that but put out no codes...took awhile to figure out it was the pick up sensor in the end of the distributor shaft

 

[miesk5]

yo,

re;

"everything starts" - what is everything? do headlight come on with key off? same for horn..does it blow with key off?

"just the engine wont turn over"

have you tried to turn engine over by

Starter Relay Jumping - Image in 92-96 @ http://www.broncolinks.com/gallery_images/StarterRelayJumpinin92-96.JPG

- Sewiw shows a remote start switch's Jumpers; you can use a small jumper;

Let us kow id starter spins and;

engine tries to start

MIESK5 NOTE; from Ford EVTM; The Control Module (PCM) runs the pump{s} for one second when it receives an ignition- on signal. It also runs the pumps as long as it receives a PIP signal from the Hall-effect devices, it continues pump operation even after the key is released from START. The hall effect is what Ccool mentioned above.

If the PIP signals fall below 120RPM, the control module cuts off the signal to the fuel pump relay or the integrated relay control module. The pump will also run when the terminals of the fuel pump test connector are jumped. the Control module signals the pump when it receives a CRANK signal, and when the Control module gets PIP signals that the engine is running. the pump does not run if the PIP indicates the engine is not running even with ignition ON {except for that first one second}.

Try a self test w/KOEO by our pal here Joe; http://broncozone.com/topic/14269-code-reader/page__pid__74587__mode__threaded

 

[BroncoJoe19]

yo,

If the PIP signals fall below 120RPM, the control module cuts off the signal to the fuel pump relay

See that you learn something everyday! /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

I didn't know that there was an RPM requirement, Do you know, does a starter turn the engine over at that rate while cranking? That seems pretty fast to me.

 

[miesk5]

yo Joe!

How's thAngs up there my friend?

I was perplexed by that once as well, but for a different problem (had a dead cell and starter seemed slower than normal)

Here are da Specs from Ford EVTM/PCED/Service Manual

PMGR (Permanent Magnet Gear Reduction) in 92-96;

Motor Diameter: 3"

Current Draw Under Normal Load: 140-200A

Current Draw Under Maximum Load: 800A

Current Draw Under No Load: 60-80A

Normal Engine Cranking Speed: 200-250 RPM

Min. Stall Torque @ 5 Volts: 11 ft-lbs

Brush Length (New): 0.66"

Son came over w/his Strobe Light & we saw it cranking at about 60 RPMS, then let starter rest for a few, then saw it over 250

Had to go thru the testing drill to find that batty had a dead cell.

btw, since you like to 'speriment...

A DIY method of measuring RPM (revolutions per minute) w/a diggie multimeter and some cheap parts

by Kieran D at http://www.fastcharged.org/electronics/handyrpm

Kinda tuff to keep the encoding wheel on the crank pulley..tho..lol

 

[zdemon84]

So i ended up giving up and giving my most trusted shop the task of fixing it. They couldn't get it to fire on the first 2 days but on the 3rd it fired all day and only stalled once but then started right back up. They are perplexed at exactly what the problem is but have hinted to a possible distributor problem.

 

[JuanC]

What was the outcome? Was the Ignition Pickup replaced or the TFI ignition replaced? What was the fuel pressure when you cracked it over?

 

[miesk5]

yo,

Sorry to suggest that you find another shop for this if it comes back.

All that shop needed to do was pick up the HAYNES Manual and go through the testing.

or to look in my site and see - such as;

The PIP is "inside" the distributor and the part is the Hall Effect (also ref to as:

Profile Ignition Pick-up (PIP) Signal, Stator, RPM)

http://www.broncolinks.com/index.php?index=393

Hesitation, Stumble, Stall, Miss, No Start, No Spark and/or Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) 211 TSB 95-15-11 for 93-95 (Shorts in Profile Ignition Pickup (PIP) & Spark Output (SPOUT)); "..The symptoms may occur during any drive mode or at idle. These concerns may be caused by the shielding drain wire (Circuit 48.) cutting through the insulation of, and shorting to, the Profile Ignition Pickup (PIP) wire (Circuit 395) or the spark output (SPOUT) wire (Circuit 929) near the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) 60-pin connector. A protruding wire from Splice 145 may also cause the same concern as the wire strand shorts to the PIP, SPOUT, or the foil wrap surrounding the drain wire..."

Ignition Control (IC) Module Inspection & Replacement Recall 94E52 for 95 Model E & F Series as follows: Kentucky Truck Plant 11/23 Thru 28, 1994; Lorain Assembly 11/22 Thru 28, 1994; Norfolk Assembly 11/22 Thru 29, 1994

Troubleshooting, Overview & Operation; "...Ford calls this electronic ignition the Thick Film Integrated-IV (TFI-IV) ignition system. The TFI module is also known as the Ignition Control Module (ICM) which reports engine position and rpm to the PCM. The PCM then determines the proper spark timing and advance, and returns a reference signal to tell the TFI module to switch the coil, thereby creating a spark. The PCM used on these vehicles is referred to by Ford as the Electronic Engine Control-IV (EEC-IV) module; read more; MIESK5 NOTEs; the rotary armature (ARMATURE, also called the Ignition Reluctor) has open areas called windows and tabs called vanes; stator is a Hall Effect device, which uses a magnetic field. It sits under the distributor cap and picks up a signal from the ARMATURE. this armature that has open areas called windows and tabs, called vanes. & ...The ARMATURE has the same number of teeth as cylinders in the engine and moves at the same speed as the distributor and camshaft. If you have a V8 then the ARMATURE has eight teeth; seven teeth are the same and one tooth is smaller to identify cylinder #1. As the ARMATURE spins with the distributor is breaks the magnetic field of the hall device generating a sine wave. This sine wave is called the raw Profile Ignition Pickup (PIP) signal and indicates the engine status at 10deg. BTDC. Now some people think the TFI is responsible for this, but that is incorrect; the PIP signal passes thru the TFI unaltered to the computer...(by Ryan M)

That shop can contact me for more info, but I'll have to charge them and add 50% because it'll take a month to 'splain the sit to them.

They and you can do that self test now.

You still may have Codes left to troubleshoot.